Universal's Epic Universe General News & Discussion

[salismetho]

Hotel rates being at all-time highs is an absolute fact. Sorry you aren't sourced well enough to know that I guess :shrug: Attendance obviously not, occupancy obviously not, but I didn't say either of those, did I? I would have thought Universal's are as well, but if not... oooof.

And why would you open a hotel that you don't need? Do you not understand market segmentation and demand? Yeah, staffing is hard for everyone in Orlando, but just because you could fill a hotel with housekeepers doesn't mean you need to, nor does not opening a hotel definitely mean you can't find housekeepers.

And no, I never said you're not living in reality. You're just don't get some things or aren't sourced well enough, nothing wrong with that.



A recession. Google "it's the economy, stupid." Unless you're trying to say USO was so awesome that it killed Disneyland even more than Disney World.

man relax a bit

 

[HandsomePete]

man relax a bit

I know, miles off topic. Joe and I go at each other occasionally on here because we both know we know things. I don’t mean any ill will.

 

[SeventyOne]

Animal Kingdom, to my knowledge, is seemingly their best bet at expansion in the 2020s. If they can create 2 fantastic E tickets they’ll be fine, but they need to be relatively Rise level to compete with a new park and continued development at USF, right? Or am I aiming far too high...

I agree with DAK, but mostly because it becomes the most expendible park. MK is MK, DHS has Star Wars and thrill rides, EPCOT has drinking and GotG (tho more love EPCOT's way wouldn't shock me as well). With 4 park days, DAK the easiest to skip, especially once Pandora not the hot new thing.

FWIW, I think Universal Studios faces the same issue. With an average of 4 theme park days in Orlando, someone is going to be the most droppable option.

 

[Nico]

WDW's problem is like the big Battleship problem, namely it takes a long time for it to make a turn. Their recent expansion mostly occurred because they were reacting to the success of Hogsmeade, and then Diagon. If those didn't happen, it's probable that only a couple of new rides would have been added this past decade. After Guardians and Tron open, they don't have a whole lot ready to go, albeit a parade or show. And Disney, as we all know, is slow to build. Pandora/Batuu/etc. were slow builds. So there's certainly going to be a time lag on major new attractions once this recent phase ends. And that's when Disney will be most vulnerable....And, that just happens to be when Epic will open.

I think what’s a bit frustrating is I love the idea of Disney proving us wrong and announcing a bunch of stuff at D23 and then actually building it all. Especially since we don’t have much knowledge about the future pipeline. If they did that, it would be incredibly exciting and dominate the news. The problem is it seems soooo improbable that it’s ultimately setting people up for disappointment to think that way. Fool me once.

They totally could do it, but they really don’t seem interested.

 

[JoeCamel]

I think what’s a bit frustrating is I love the idea of Disney proving us wrong and announcing a bunch of stuff at D23 and then actually building it all. Especially since we don’t have much knowledge about the future pipeline. If they did that, it would be incredibly exciting and dominate the news. The problem is it seems soooo improbable that it’s ultimately setting people up for disappointment to think that way. Fool me once.

They totally could do it, but they really don’t seem interested.

I don't think the numbers work for them to make a multi billion dollar investment. They can't work out how they can make back all that money plus profit 10% year over year with the parks. If the numbers don't work it won't get greenlit.
As fans we want them to respect the customer and build us new stuff year after year to "keep it fresh". It looks from my seat like they are trying to shift more to the once in a lifetime go all out guest plus extended family or the golden oak crowd.
APs, fans and GS are not the consideration as they want new eyes in their old rides spending max bucks in the stores while staying in very overpriced rooms.
I can't see where they will support the DVC model outside the contracts for the 40 years it takes to expire them.

 

[fryoj]

Let's be honest about what "a seismic shift" in Disneys eyes, as little ase ~7.5-10% of WDW visitors would cause major problems for investors and Chapek. But before you "but Tommy Disney wouldn't lose that many visitors to Universal" I'll remind you that Between 1990 & 1994 Disney World haemorrhaged visitors, they lost 5 million visitors (around 15% of their visitor numbers at the time) in the space of five years because people didn't feel they were getting value for money. Eisner had spent ten years scalping people with ticket price increases and people voted with their feet. Incidentally 5 million visitors is around 8.4% of 2019 visitor numbers. We all of course know what 1998's response to this problem was, but lets be realistic about how quick Disney can respond to the threat of EU/USF expansion in the coming years

I think that kind of fall off isn't that far out of the realm of possibility. We are on the verge of the stimulus money and the missed 2020 vacation money people had saved up being burnt out. Couple that with inflation and all the shortages, and people have to start cutting back on unneeded spending. Then you start factoring the Disney price increases and reduction in services, and even the Disney faithful are starting to push back. You are seeing a lot more "We went to Universal for a couple days on our trip and next year are just going to go there instead of Disney" type posts. And all of this is before Universal opens a new park. Even if they aren't going to Universal, going to the beach or staying home, hurts Disney. The next few years are definitely going to be interesting.

 

[HandsomePete]

We are on the verge of the stimulus money and the missed 2020 vacation money people had saved up being burnt out. Couple that with inflation and all the shortages, and people have to start cutting back on unneeded spending.

The ugly truth is that the rich got richer out of the pandemic - a lot richer. The stimulus money folks from 2020/early 2021 aren't the ones still piling into Orlando.

I dunno, maybe it's that I'm going on like 20+ years of reading online how *this* is going to be the moment where Universal lands an actual blow. Heck, there were people at Universal who thought pushing to reopen first in summer 2020 was their moment. For every Blockbuster Video that gets knocked off by a Netflix, there's a McDonald's that just keeps raking in cash and cranking out burgers despite competitive forces throwing everything and the kitchen sink at them.

 

[fryoj]

The ugly truth is that the rich got richer out of the pandemic - a lot richer. The stimulus money folks from 2020/early 2021 aren't the ones still piling into Orlando.

I dunno, maybe it's that I'm going on like 20+ years of reading online how *this* is going to be the moment where Universal lands an actual blow. Heck, there were people at Universal who thought pushing to reopen first in summer 2020 was their moment. For every Blockbuster Video that gets knocked off by a Netflix, there's a McDonald's that just keeps raking in cash and cranking out burgers despite competitive forces throwing everything and the kitchen sink at them.

Pretty sure the point of my post was that Universal isn't the one that's going to deal the blow. The economy and Disney's own policies are going to have the most effect. Universal is just another piece of the puzzle.

 

[Disneyhead]

The paradigm shift happened in 2010 and Universal has been gaining market share since then.

And no, Universal is not going to really hurt WDW, nor do they want to. Universal just wants a bigger piece of the pie. The interesting thing about the numbers from 2010-the Pandemic was that Universal's numbers have been steadily increasing for the most part, but Disney's numbers have held solid or had slight increases. So what has happened is Universal didn't take people from Disney, they brought more people into the market.

Chapek is a bigger danger to WDW than Universal is.

 

[Jerroddragon]

The ugly truth is that the rich got richer out of the pandemic - a lot richer. The stimulus money folks from 2020/early 2021 aren't the ones still piling into Orlando.

I dunno, maybe it's that I'm going on like 20+ years of reading online how *this* is going to be the moment where Universal lands an actual blow. Heck, there were people at Universal who thought pushing to reopen first in summer 2020 was their moment. For every Blockbuster Video that gets knocked off by a Netflix, there's a McDonald's that just keeps raking in cash and cranking out burgers despite competitive forces throwing everything and the kitchen sink at them.

Billionaires added $5 trillion to their fortunes during the pandemic

Billionaires added $5 trillion to their fortunes during the pandemic, according to Oxfam, exacerbating economic inequality as the pandemic pushed millions of people around the world into poverty.

www.cnn.com

They got 5 Trillion dollars richer....but budget cuts because...ummmm well...i mean that island they bought is lonely without a second island...lol

 

[quinnmac000]

I don't think the numbers work for them to make a multi billion dollar investment. They can't work out how they can make back all that money plus profit 10% year over year with the parks. If the numbers don't work it won't get greenlit.
As fans we want them to respect the customer and build us new stuff year after year to "keep it fresh". It looks from my seat like they are trying to shift more to the once in a lifetime go all out guest plus extended family or the golden oak crowd.
APs, fans and GS are not the consideration as they want new eyes in their old rides spending max bucks in the stores while staying in very overpriced rooms.
I can't see where they will support the DVC model outside the contracts for the 40 years it takes to expire them.

I would argue more so Disney Shareholders/Wall Street can't stomach large scale investments that don't increase ROI in a single quarter.....which is part of the reason why Disney can't go bull run on massive expansions.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

The paradigm shift happened in 2010 and Universal has been gaining market share since then.

And no, Universal is not going to really hurt WDW, nor do they want to. Universal just wants a bigger piece of the pie. The interesting thing about the numbers from 2010-the Pandemic was that Universal's numbers have been steadily increasing for the most part, but Disney's numbers have held solid or had slight increases. So what has happened is Universal didn't take people from Disney, they brought more people into the market.

Chapek is a bigger danger to WDW than Universal is.

Bingo.

 

[Cup_Of_Coffee]

The paradigm shift happened in 2010 and Universal has been gaining market share since then.

And no, Universal is not going to really hurt WDW, nor do they want to. Universal just wants a bigger piece of the pie. The interesting thing about the numbers from 2010-the Pandemic was that Universal's numbers have been steadily increasing for the most part, but Disney's numbers have held solid or had slight increases. So what has happened is Universal didn't take people from Disney, they brought more people into the market.

Chapek is a bigger danger to WDW than Universal is.

I mean we and another family started vacationing every year there starting in 2011, so this adds up frankly. We did maybe 3 days at Disney in those 7 years or so but was always a Universal trip so this makes sense. We did WDW a few times when younger, but not a yearly thing.

 

[fryoj]

Not sure if this has ever come up, but do the plans suggest they planned a parade route into this park?

 

[tommyhawkins]

Not sure if this has ever come up, but do the plans suggest they planned a parade route into this park?

I found one (Orange lines) that comes in, loops around the fountain and either comes back the way it came or possibly leaves by potter. Fortunately because the ideal buildout guy has traced the Voldemort map I can over lay mine to show where it could go:

 

[Happytycho]

I'm not sure if it was ever posted here or not, but all of the HTTYD building permits were issued a couple of weeks ago and a corresponding notice of commencement filed.

Going by the notices of commencement, the main contractors are:
Nintendo: Balfour Beatty
Monsters: Whiting-Turner
Wizarding World: PCL
HTTYD: Hensel Phelps
Hub: W. G. Yates & Sons Construction
BOH large warehouses & office: Walbridge Aldinger

 

[mandstaft]

Does anyone think they'll use a version of the Knight Bus (with show windows) to connect Epic Universe with another park or both? That closed off street by the two hotels across the back aside of the park seem to indicate they could make use of a private access road to do so.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

Does anyone think they'll use a version of the Knight Bus (with show windows) to connect Epic Universe with another park or both? That closed off street by the two hotels across the back aside of the park seem to indicate they could make use of a private access road to do so.

I don't think so.

 

[tielo]

Does anyone think they'll use a version of the Knight Bus (with show windows) to connect Epic Universe with another park or both? That closed off street by the two hotels across the back aside of the park seem to indicate they could make use of a private access road to do so.

The EU Wizarding World land will have different time area so I don't think the Knight Bus will be an option, maybe a DeLorean?
But in all seriousness I think they don't, they could but they don't.

 

[Cup_Of_Coffee]

The EU Wizarding World land will have different time area so I don't think the Knight Bus will be an option, maybe a DeLorean?
But in all seriousness I think they don't, they could but they don't.

Instead of the Minnie Vans there’s just now gonna be endless Deloreans in Orlando.