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CineSational: A Symphonic Spectacular

  • Thread starter Thread starter Jwhee
  • Start date Start date Apr 18, 2023
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Mad Dog

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  • Yesterday at 7:13 PM
  • #541
DOOMBOT said:
To not even offer a seasonal nighttime lagoon show in its' place is actually crazy. USF stay losing.
Click to expand...
Yeah....and they always lament that guests don't stay late. This is why.....They also cut an hour out of Epic. It's scheduled closing is 9:00 PM Feb. & March......Well they just said they're doing great with Epic....but then...why the cuts? Sometimes Universal decisions just don't add up to their dialogue. I love the parks. I spend lots of time and money there. But, sometimes I just don't understand their Executive decisions that aren't very pro guest. ...................Maybe they hired some ex Chapek mgt. spreadsheet people that got whacked at Disney ;) :D:lmao:
 
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TheCodeMan95

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  • Today at 7:08 AM
  • #542
It's always bothered me that they don't even show it on off-nights during HHN season.
 
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UniversalRBLX

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  • Today at 10:22 AM
  • #543
TheCodeMan95 said:
It's always bothered me that they don't even show it on off-nights during HHN season.
Click to expand...
Especially with HHN running 5 out of 7 nights. Though, sundown isn't until 9-9:15PM in September, so they'll need to push back the operating hours if they want to keep the number of operating hours flat.

Just for reference, Cinesational operated 172 times last year (47% of the year).
 
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belloq87

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  • Today at 1:07 PM
  • #544
UniversalRBLX said:
Just for reference, Cinesational operated 172 times last year (47% of the year).
Click to expand...
That's pretty unacceptable.

Hard for a show to really catch on if it's not running more nights than it's running.
 
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Brian G.

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  • Today at 1:27 PM
  • #545
Just to add some clarity (not defending), about 60 nights are unavailable due to HHN, so it's running 172/305 days, so it's 56%
 
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Mad Dog

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  • Today at 1:29 PM
  • #546
belloq87 said:
That's pretty unacceptable.

Hard for a show to really catch on if it's not running more nights than it's running.
Click to expand...
Exactly. Universal never gives their shows a real chance. This show is as good as anything WDW has to offer. Universal Executives need to 'Believe' in their product....56% is really not acceptable, especially when they're not running it in March, one of the year's busiest tourist months. Crazy.
 
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belloq87

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  • Today at 1:46 PM
  • #547
Brian G. said:
Just to add some clarity (not defending), about 60 nights are unavailable due to HHN, so it's running 172/305 days, so it's 56%
Click to expand...
While fair, that opens up a whole other discussion about whether or not the resort should have a nighttime spectacular for its day guests even when a special event is going on*. If HHN is chewing up two months(ish) of availability, a seasonal spectacular at IOA seems like something that should be considered.

* With three of the four WDW parks having major nighttime offerings, they can get away with Magic Kingdom closing to the general public early for MNSSHP, for example.
 
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Brian G.

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  • Today at 1:49 PM
  • #548
belloq87 said:
While fair, that opens up a whole other discussion about whether or not the resort should have a nighttime spectacular for its day guests even when a special event is going on*. If HHN is chewing up two months(ish) of availability, a seasonal spectacular at IOA seems like something that should be considered.

* With three of the four WDW parks having major nighttime offerings, they can get away with Magic Kingdom closing to the general public early for MNSSHP, for example.
Click to expand...

Hold on, I'm lost... lol

Strictly speaking for the HHN timeframe, they use the lagoon; it's just not called CineSational. Plus, the parks close at 5, way before sundown.

IOA HAD the Dark Arts to offset USF's closure, and it's coming back this year after a couple year hiatus.
 
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belloq87

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  • Today at 1:51 PM
  • #549
I'm saying if USF can't have a nighttime show for the regular day guests during HHN season, they should consider doing a seasonal nighttime show at IOA.
 
Brian G.

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  • Today at 1:52 PM
  • #550
belloq87 said:
I'm saying if USF can't have a nighttime show for the regular day guests during HHN season, they should consider doing a seasonal nighttime show at IOA.
Click to expand...

I added this after the post:

IOA HAD the Dark Arts to offset USF's closure, and it's coming back this year after a couple year hiatus.
 
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Clive

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  • Today at 2:23 PM
  • #551
Brian G. said:
I added this after the post:

IOA HAD the Dark Arts to offset USF's closure, and it's coming back this year after a couple year hiatus.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I think you guys are agreeing. Dark Arts coming back to give day guests a nighttime show option is a really smart move.
 
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UniversalRBLX

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  • Today at 2:34 PM
  • #552
Brian G. said:
Just to add some clarity (not defending), about 60 nights are unavailable due to HHN, so it's running 172/305 days, so it's 56%
Click to expand...
Fair point, but there are at least 2 days in the week they can push USF hour's until 9 to provide a nighttime show. With USF now opening at 10AM, they could push closing to 9PM. It would add an additional hour to the average operating day from last year on non-HHN nights.

belloq87 said:
While fair, that opens up a whole other discussion about whether or not the resort should have a nighttime spectacular for its day guests even when a special event is going on*. If HHN is chewing up two months(ish) of availability, a seasonal spectacular at IOA seems like something that should be considered.

* With three of the four WDW parks having major nighttime offerings, they can get away with Magic Kingdom closing to the general public early for MNSSHP, for example.
Click to expand...
IOA would be a beautiful setting for a nighttime show. And yes, that's the benefit of visiting WDW. You are guaranteed a nighttime show at 3/4 parks.

At Universal you might be lucky to get one proper nighttime show at 1/3 parks and maybe a 5-8 minute projection show at Hogwarts. (Mind you, I like the projection shows, but it doesn't qualify as a major nighttime spectacular).

Epic getting a proper nighttime show soon will resolve a lot of my concerns about the resort overall.


Like @Mad Dog mentioned, CineSational is an absolutely fantastic show (it's my favorite in Orlando) and Universal should display it as often as they can.
 
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DOOMBOT

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  • Today at 4:59 PM
  • #553
Can someone remind me why IoA doesn't utilize the lagoon for a big EPCOT-style lagoon show?

Dark Arts is a solid operational move. I think limiting the main nighttime show of your resort to a singular IP isn't. I feel like there should be a general nighttime show at one or the other North Campus park at any given time.
 
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Legacy

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  • Today at 5:17 PM
  • #554
DOOMBOT said:
Can someone remind me why IoA doesn't utilize the lagoon for a big EPCOT-style lagoon show?
Click to expand...
It was never designed for one. That’s why there’s no “viewing areas” of the lagoon. The areas that did “exist” were meant to serve as queue for the old lagoon shuttle boats. Think about how many “unobstructed” views of the lagoon there. No imagine 10,000 people trying to watch a show from those locations.

And a big reason it was never designed for it was due to a lack of space backstage to store/reset show elements. The service ramp into the lagoon is just big enough for a couple of work boats.
 
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Parkscope Joe

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  • Today at 5:38 PM
  • #555
Legacy said:
It was never designed for one. That’s why there’s no “viewing areas” of the lagoon. The areas that did “exist” were meant to serve as queue for the old lagoon shuttle boats. Think about how many “unobstructed” views of the lagoon there. No imagine 10,000 people trying to watch a show from those locations.

And a big reason it was never designed for it was due to a lack of space backstage to store/reset show elements. The service ramp into the lagoon is just big enough for a couple of work boats.
Click to expand...

So i want to push back a bit on this. Dave Cobb has a video of Dale Mason talking about the tiered areas in Port of Entry being for a nighttime show in the center of the lagoon. Timestamped at 4:00 (whole video is worth watching).



I do agree with your point that cramming 10k people into the spaces we had (pre VelociCoaster) was likely the issue of doing a show. So now here we are 27 years later without a show and it's just feels like momentum now plus a bit of product differentiation.
 
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Jwhee

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  • Today at 6:19 PM
  • #556
Parkscope Joe said:
I do agree with your point that cramming 10k people into the spaces we had (pre VelociCoaster) was likely the issue of doing a show. So now here we are 27 years later without a show and it's just feels like momentum now plus a bit of product differentiation.
Click to expand...
Jurassic Park by far had the largest viewing area before the coaster

It is still possible, but for sure not ideal.

They did a lagoon show the last 2 NYEs

 
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Legacy

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  • Today at 8:24 PM
  • #557
Parkscope Joe said:
So i want to push back a bit on this. Dave Cobb has a video of Dale Mason talking about the tiered areas in Port of Entry being for a nighttime show in the center of the lagoon. Timestamped at 4:00 (whole video is worth watching).



I do agree with your point that cramming 10k people into the spaces we had (pre VelociCoaster) was likely the issue of doing a show. So now here we are 27 years later without a show and it's just feels like momentum now plus a bit of product differentiation.
Click to expand...

This is fair. I just remember when it first opened realizing that the only islands with any good viewing spots were Port of Entry, Jurassic Park, and a small part of Marvel. Toon, Lost Continent, and Seuss didn’t have clearly obvious viewing space. That always struck me as… short sighted.
Jwhee said:
Jurassic Park by far had the largest viewing area before the coaster

It is still possible, but for sure not ideal.

They did a lagoon show the last 2 NYEs

Click to expand...

I do think the benefit of fireworks is height. To do something like CineSational is very different.
 
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HHN Maddux

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  • Today at 8:27 PM
  • #558
Legacy said:
This is fair. I just remember when it first opened realizing that the only islands with any good viewing spots were Port of Entry, Jurassic Park, and a small part of Marvel. Toon, Lost Continent, and Seuss didn’t have clearly obvious viewing space. That always struck me as… short sighted.

I do think the benefit of fireworks is height. To do something like CineSational is very different.
Click to expand...
Actually, TL does have the walking path that goes right down next to the Popeye's ride path and up against the lagoon, and Seuss has the byway to the left of its main entrance. TLC's really the only one that doesn't have too great of a spot besides the Mythos balcony (which, now that I think about it, in the future could be a great dining package spot should IoA ever get fireworks).
 
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OrlandoGuy

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  • Today at 9:35 PM
  • #559
As good as Cinematic may be, I think its operating schedule reinforces something I’ve been saying…Disney is a “destination,” Universal is a place to ride rides. The nighttime show isn’t a ride…it’s a nice distraction/capacity add when the park hours allow for it. But in seasons where lines for rides are short or there are distractions (haunted houses, concerts, etc.), it’s not something that’s going to specifically keep guests around. There’s no way Universal would extend their non-HHN September hours just for the purposes of this show, because the majority of guests that go to Universal aren’t there for that.

RE any pushback to this, I’ll say this: Guests tour Universal in the same way they tour a Six Flags, and the ethos of that is everywhere—in-park ads for Express Passes, commitment to adding one ride/year (“season”), the complete disinterest in utilizing show venues, etc. I’d hesitate to compare the operation of Universal to Disney, because they’re two very different corporate philosophies…

* The Walt Disney Company is just as much the parks as it is the movies and TV. The parks are part of the fabric of the company culture, which is about shows, entertainment, etc.
*Comcast is cable…they lucked into a much smaller parks divisions and they’ve learned how to extract max profit out of them. It’s great that they let very talented and enthusiastic people do that (who can go to bat for nighttime shows in the first place), but ultimately the parks are going to be run and operated like a profit center as part of a larger business.
 
Mad Dog

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  • Today at 9:53 PM
  • #560
OrlandoGuy said:
As good as Cinematic may be, I think its operating schedule reinforces something I’ve been saying…Disney is a “destination,” Universal is a place to ride rides. The nighttime show isn’t a ride…it’s a nice distraction/capacity add when the park hours allow for it. But in seasons where lines for rides are short or there are distractions (haunted houses, concerts, etc.), it’s not something that’s going to specifically keep guests around. There’s no way Universal would extend their non-HHN September hours just for the purposes of this show, because the majority of guests that go to Universal aren’t there for that.

RE any pushback to this, I’ll say this: Guests tour Universal in the same way they tour a Six Flags, and the ethos of that is everywhere—in-park ads for Express Passes, commitment to adding one ride/year (“season”), the complete disinterest in utilizing show venues, etc. I’d hesitate to compare the operation of Universal to Disney, because they’re two very different corporate philosophies…

* The Walt Disney Company is just as much the parks as it is the movies and TV. The parks are part of the fabric of the company culture, which is about shows, entertainment, etc.
*Comcast is cable…they lucked into a much smaller parks divisions and they’ve learned how to extract max profit out of them. It’s great that they let very talented and enthusiastic people do that (who can go to bat for nighttime shows in the first place), but ultimately the parks are going to be run and operated like a profit center as part of a larger business.
Click to expand...
It's mostly because Universal's decisions, like this one, causes the results to be self fulfilling. They never give any of these shows, and late evening closings, a chance to be impregnated in guests minds/habits. That Six Flags analogy might have made some sense when Universal only had three hotels, but it makes very poor business sense with all the on site hotels filled with guests that are focused to on site activities.

And, keep in mind, March, as I said above, is prime tourist season. No reason not to run the shows in March with the Spring Break crowds.
 
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