Universal Orlando Resort Expansion (Part 1)

[Cole]

I would kill for a trolley, that would be tons of fun. I feel like uni needs a third gate just to have a third gate. What Disney has over them is quantity, people automatically think more parks, more quality. 3 parks plus a waterpark would really set them apart as a destination. More people will make entire trips to universal as they would Disney. This is what universal wants and needs, I thought they were already stepping up but this takes the cake

 

[twebber55]

I would kill for a trolley, that would be tons of fun. I feel like uni needs a third gate just to have a third gate. What Disney has over them is quantity, people automatically think more parks, more quality. 3 parks plus a waterpark would really set them apart as a destination. More people will make entire trips to universal as they would Disney. This is what universal wants and needs, I thought they were already stepping up but this takes the cake

agree

3 parks and a water park turns Universal into a true week long resort destination
longer stay, more money spent for food and hotels

im actually a DVC owner and i could see myself staying and going to universal
pretty exciting times

i did like the idea on the podcast about a central transportation hub in between the two sites

 

[UK-Trigg]

So, short of patience as I am... I called a little heron friend of mine today to follow up on the info that Uni was interested in the property and to finally ask the follow-up-of-the-day.

Turns out that all the hopes and dreams of many of you is the reason why they want it, must have it. Hotels too of course. It sounds like they have been in talks with Colony for quite some time. Far longer than any of us imagined.

If this be the case then I wonder how far ahead in the planning they are.

This is very exciting news and I don't want to get carried away but this certainly turns the chatter from an if to a maybe.

 

[IzzyB]

As much as I love old Epcot, there is a reason Disney started to move away from the original point of the park.

Universal is going to play it "safe" in terms of concept if they were to build a 3rd park.

This. There is a reason Epcot has run annual free events for a very long time. There is also a reason it was the first park to get a scavenger hunt type thing in the park for kids. It is the only park with free craft project. It was known as the boring park and without all those extra things attendance would be down pretty bad for a long time now. I know a lot of people don't want it, but Epcot will change and move away from its original concept. It has to because the original concept won't bring guests in.

As for Universal, I say a 2021 to 2022 park opening. They come up with some kind of transportation that is not buses at some point. It will be HP like immersion thru the whole park. It will have 1 or 2 coasters and a couple thrill rides, but will still have many family friendly rides. I say it will be IP based because honestly that sells tickets and merch. Also, I don't trust Uni to do an original concept well. Honestly storytelling is not their strength. Not sure why anyone thinks it is. FJ has no storyline and many of their storylines are not the best or duplicated over and over again.

Oh and lastly to someone who said that thrill park people have money, is just not right. The age group that goes to thrill parks is actually the age group with the least amount of money. The age group with families is your more typical age group with money. They have been established in their jobs and have moved up and make more money. Most college grads are not rolling in cash. Their are some majors that have high paying graduates. If you are one of those, most of your friends probably were in the same major, so you don't realize that it is not the norm. But teachers, liberal arts, some business majors, and even lawyers and doctors struggle for the first couple years. Some people even have to live with their parents for awhile to get out of debt. Not everyone graduates into computer programming, engineering, or other high paying jobs. Universal would be dumb to build a thrill only park. Not saying there isn't room in the Orlando market, but it shouldn't be Uni. The biggest complaints I hear about Universal is it a “thrill” park and doesn’t have the “theme” or “magic” feeling of Disney. I hear all the time it is good and the new HP area is great, but the rest is just “meh”. Universal shouldn’t add to that stigma. Oh and I hear this from people who are ages 20 to 70. So even those in the target thrill park age still say that. Oh and I live in Orlando and LOVE roller coasters

 

[UK-Trigg]

Here ya go...

Could you show this from a zoomed out shot please Teebin? Would be nice to visualise it against their current property.

 

[JungleSkip]

It was known as the boring park

I don't want to get into this, but this is patently not true. EPCOT did great in attendance and guest spending metrics before they started to change it into the muddled, crappy park we see today. They did not change EPCOT because people thought it was boring. They changed EPCOT because they got cheap and Eisner just did not have any clue what to do to the park.

 

[IzzyB]

I don't want to get into this, but this is patently not true. EPCOT did great in attendance and guest spending metrics before they started to change it into the muddled, crappy park we see today. They did not change EPCOT because people thought it was boring. They changed EPCOT because they got cheap and Eisner just did not have any clue what to do to the park.

I can't argue with the fact that Eisner destroyed the park and made it cheap. They could do a lot more with the park and should. But it doesn't change the fact that even my mother said she got bored at the park and didn't torture us kids with it every year we went. Many people I talk to say the same thing. They love the places to eat and the few select things to do, but overall prefer the other 3 parks. Epcot makes money because of their great places to eat. Tying into that they create great events. But the rides and things to do in the park are just not there.

On side note and to not double post, I wanted to comment on the transportation. Do you really think central Florida government would be against high speed transportation if the convention center was one of the stops? Can you imagine the conventions they could get into this town with having a theme park 5 minutes away via mass transportation? That and if the airport gets connected the other way? It would be a huge win for the county to have something like that. Now Disney would not be too happy, but then again Uni has more money now to lobby for things when in the past they never could lobby more than Disney.

 

[ChrisFL]

It's not confusing at all save for one dead end space. Otherwise it's a big circle with an island in the middle. Some of the lands meander in themselves, but the park isn't confusing

Yes, it's a very well hidden hub and spoke layout, with the volcano being the "hub"....it's done so brilliantly it doesn't feel like a hub and spoke.

 

[JungleSkip]

Yes, it's a very well hidden hub and spoke layout, with the volcano being the "hub"....it's done so brilliantly it doesn't feel like a hub and spoke.

Yup.

Would be interested in Uni doing something similar here. They've yet to do a hub/spoke type park.

 

[fryoj]

I think the topography of the property will affect the layout of the park. Specifically, if they are allowed to move those lakes/retention ponds. In they can't, I think a layout like usf is more likely with the large lagoon in the center.

 

[misterID]

I don't want to get into this, but this is patently not true. EPCOT did great in attendance and guest spending metrics before they started to change it into the muddled, crappy park we see today. They did not change EPCOT because people thought it was boring. They changed EPCOT because they got cheap and Eisner just did not have any clue what to do to the park.

WDI didn't know what to do with it, either.

I will always maintain M:S was a major factor in EPCOT'S decline. It was not a hit, and Eisner was convinced its success would lead to clones in every park. Hugely expensive for the time, and a big disappointment.

 

[JungleSkip]

I think the topography of the property will affect the layout of the park. Specifically, if they are allowed to move those lakes/retention ponds. In they can't, I think a layout like usf is more likely with the large lagoon in the center.

The land is humongous. They can fit whatever they want in there, as Teebin's photo proves.

WDI didn't know what to do with it, either.

Disagree. The larger Space Pavilion was a great design. There were viable, EPCOT-y upgrades to be made that would have also solved its menu planning problems. They just weren't given the green light.

 

[misterID]

The land is humongous. They can fit whatever they want in there, as Teebin's photo proves.



Disagree. The larger Space Pavilion was a great design. There were viable, EPCOT-y upgrades to be made that would have also solved its menu planning problems. They just weren't given the green light.

The spacewalk concept was good, but no one in WDI ever considered it would ever get made. Basically it was pitched to be the sacrificial lamb for inevitable budget cuts to protect their main focus which was the centrifuge, this was basically backed up by Eddie Soto. The space pavilion idea was around before that group of imagineers latched on to it.

 

[fryoj]

The land is humongous. They can fit whatever they want in there, as Teebin's photo proves.

While it is humongous, it is cut up by some large lakes/retention ponds. All of the docs we've seen on the colony property specifically cuts around those ponds and doesn't just include them with the property. I'd assume that means that the new owner would not be able to touch them. The point of my post was that if they can't touch them at all, then they have to work around them. Teebin's photo completely covered one of them up. Now it may be just a matter getting approval to dig a new hole somewhere else on property and filling those in. If so, then its no big deal at all. But if they can't touch them, like Teebin suggested they couldn't touch that creek, then it creates design choices for them.

 

[Teebin]

I think the topography of the property will affect the layout of the park. Specifically, if they are allowed to move those lakes/retention ponds. In they can't, I think a layout like usf is more likely with the large lagoon in the center.

Those retention ponds were created with some other development in mind, based on the parking and roof runoff. They can all be filled in. Any new development will have to have its own water management plan. Note how they have been moving ponds around for VB.

Also note that most of those ponds were only created in the past 10-20 years. They are brand new.

 

[fryoj]

Those retention ponds were created with some other development in mind, based on the parking and roof runoff. They can all be filled in. Any new development will have to have its own water management plan. Note how they have been moving ponds around for VB.

Also note that most of those ponds were only created in the past 10-20 years. They are brand new.

After looking at the colony stuff again, it only cuts around the ponds on the SE side of the property. The big one in the middle is shown with the property, so I agree that moving that one around should be no problem. I just didn't know if they cut around something, if it couldn't be touched at all. It's like how they cut out the ROW for the Kirkman extension, I'd assume that would be property that could not be built on.

 

[Teebin]

I just didn't know if they cut around something, if it couldn't be touched at all.

Yeah, I must agree that I am stymied as to why they drew lines around them. Also note that there is a right of way off Uni blvd that is also built into those lines. They even built and entrance for it. I would assume that can go too.

 

[bdurden]

I can't argue with the fact that Eisner destroyed the park and made it cheap. They could do a lot more with the park and should. But it doesn't change the fact that even my mother said she got bored at the park and didn't torture us kids with it every year we went. Many people I talk to say the same thing. They love the places to eat and the few select things to do, but overall prefer the other 3 parks. Epcot makes money because of their great places to eat. Tying into that they create great events. But the rides and things to do in the park are just not there.

Let's be clear that this is an entirely subjective statement.
EPCOT remains a favorite Orlando area theme park to most and is still considered one of the greatest theme parks in the world.

 

[JungleSkip]

Let's be clear that this is an entirely subjective statement.
EPCOT remains a favorite Orlando area theme park to most and is still considered one of the greatest theme parks in the world.

:saywhat:

 

[Scott W.]

Let's be clear that this is an entirely subjective statement.
EPCOT remains a favorite Orlando area theme park to most and is still considered one of the greatest theme parks in the world.

To most? Let's not get carried away.