Universal Orlando Resort Expansion (Part 1)

[mahnamahna]

I could see it being 1/2 IP and 1/2 original. If they ever manage to convince the Tolkeins to let them use LOTR (unlikely as it is), it would be a good anchor property to get people in the gate.

And I mean, this is still probably at least 10 years away, so a new, hot property could pop up in that time as well.

Yeah, LOTR might be a pipe dream... but honestly, Universal could do a lot with a 3rd gate- Universal Monsters, SpongeBob, TMNT, Laika, Hanna Barbera (Scooby and Flintstones are getting reboots, and they have a history at Universal Orlando), Hasbro, Star Trek, James Bond, Warcraft, Doctor Who, Fast and Furious, Godzilla... a bunch of random IPs at the moment but the options are there.

A new, grander version of Lost Continent would be great... some all-new original sections, too.

And for an anchor IP if they don't get LOTR (which seems likely), I'd say Mario would be a good one to at least look into for a 3rd gate - kid-friendly, easily one of the most recognizable cartoon characters of all time, would be a merch machine (so many items from the Mushroom Kingdom you could sell), plenty of room for Potter-level theming, potential for ground-breaking interactivity, and endless possiblities for attractions (Super Mario Bros, Mario Kart, Mario Party, Luigi's Mansion, Paper Mario, Yoshi, DK, Wario, Super Mario Galaxy).

I know video games aren't a popular idea on here, WDWMagic or pretty much any of the boards , but Mario transcends a niche gamer demographic. Again, this would probably only happen if LOTR doesn't come through but really aside from LOTR, the only IP that has a chance at truly competing with Star Wars and Potter in terms of hype would be Mario (just can't see a whole Star Trek section of the park - a more general sci-fi area would make more sense). Pokemon and even Zelda could also work, but those are more niche than Mario (merch possibilities is also endless for those two as well)

I'd love to see a few big IPs, a few small ones, and some originality as well. As long as it's not Pacific Rim :look:

 

[JungleSkip]

I doubt this is true. If you can find such a news release, I would appreciate it.

There are plans for a new I-4 off ramp in the lower area. Someone has posted them here a few times over the years.

 

[ChrisFL]

Yeah, LOTR might be a pipe dream... but honestly, Universal could do a lot with a 3rd gate- Universal Monsters, SpongeBob, TMNT, Laika, Hanna Barbera (Scooby and Flintstones are getting reboots, and they have a history at Universal Orlando), Hasbro, Star Trek, James Bond, Warcraft, Doctor Who, Fast and Furious, Godzilla... a bunch of random IPs at the moment but the options are there.

A new, grander version of Lost Continent would be great... some all-new original sections, too.

And for an anchor IP if they don't get LOTR (which seems likely), I'd say Mario would be a good one to at least look into for a 3rd gate - kid-friendly, easily one of the most recognizable cartoon characters of all time, would be a merch machine (so many items from the Mushroom Kingdom you could sell), plenty of room for Potter-level theming, potential for ground-breaking interactivity, and endless possiblities for attractions (Super Mario Bros, Mario Kart, Mario Party, Luigi's Mansion, Paper Mario, Yoshi, DK, Wario, Super Mario Galaxy).

I know video games aren't a popular idea on here, WDWMagic or pretty much any of the boards , but Mario transcends a niche gamer demographic. Again, this would probably only happen if LOTR doesn't come through but really aside from LOTR, the only IP that has a chance at truly competing with Star Wars and Potter in terms of hype would be Mario (just can't see a whole Star Trek section of the park - a more general sci-fi area would make more sense). Pokemon and even Zelda could also work, but those are more niche than Mario (merch possibilities is also endless for those two as well)

I'd love to see a few big IPs, a few small ones, and some originality as well. As long as it's not Pacific Rim :look:

Laika, the soviet space dog?

 

[HalfGlass]

I'd love to see a few big IPs, a few small ones, and some originality as well. As long as it's not Pacific Rim :look:

Which it will never be, despite getting a sequel. Maybe in Universal Japan.

 

[TylerDurden]

I imagine a third gate would have lands based on genres, sort of like those proposed Paramount parks were to have. There would be a sci-fi section, western section, fantasy section, etc...all filled with appropriate IP-based attractions. Just my opinion..

 

[mahnamahna]

Laika, the soviet space dog?

Nope the one that produces some great stop-motion films like Coraline and ParaNorman. Also happens to be indirectly owned/distributed by Universal, so I don't think they'd have to pay license fees for attractions based on them.

 

[Parkscope Joe]

I worry about the overall market saturation and the addition of a third park. As we see with WDW, a vacation lasts only so long.

 

[JungleSkip]

As long as it's not Pacific Rim :look:

There's the door. Don't let it hit you on the way out.

:wave:

 

[quinnmac000]

The thing with DisneySeas is its actually like 75% original 25% IP which allows all the great theming and experiences. I do agree if a new 3rd gate is going to happen it needs a strong anchor but I want the rest of it to be 1000% original and new but still crazy level immersive and mind-blowing. Its not the IP that makes an attraction good, its the level of love and dedication of the creators that makes an attraction great.

 

[JungleSkip]

I worry about the overall market saturation and the addition of a third park. As we see with WDW, a vacation lasts only so long.

With SeaWorld taking a dive and UOR growing the Orlando customer base, I think it would work out fine.

 

[mahnamahna]

I imagine a third gate would have lands based on genres, sort of like those proposed Paramount parks were to have. There would be a sci-fi section, western section, fantasy section, etc...all filled with appropriate IP-based attractions. Just my opinion..

That could work - lots of potential

Sci-Fi - Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, Godzilla, Alien, Futurama, Doctor Who
Western - Hill Valley 1885?... this would probably be all-original IPs maybe a Fievel show?
Fantasy (more kid centric) - Laika, Smurfs, MLP, some non-IP based attractions
High Fantasy - LOTR and Warcraft
Horror - Classic Monsters, Psycho, Walking Dead
Anime (probably too niche) - Pokemon, Naruto, Dragon Ball Z, etc
Toons - Hanna Barbera, Sony Pictures Animation (not likely since they've got Laika, Illumination, and past connections to Nick and Hanna Barbera... no reason to add another), Nick

It might be too similar to USF and IOA if it's based just on genres. I could see it working, but it might be seen as an extension of the other parks unless they come up with a unique hook...

 

[TylerDurden]

I worry about the overall market saturation and the addition of a third park. As we see with WDW, a vacation lasts only so long.

Yeah, this should be a pretty big concern...theyll also need to see how all their new hotel space does after the Potter hype wears out, because as is it seems to me they have a lot of hotel rooms for two relatively small parks.

The thing is that as is, IOA and Universal are not full-day parks. Its possible to do all the major rides in each park in less than a day. A third gate would probably serve more as a way to spread out capacity. If a third gate remains true to the nature of IOA and USF, it shouldnt require an extra day of vacation to enjoy. But I do agree it shouldnt be green-lit until USF and IOA are full with guests, which they arent even close right now.

 

[Nick]

With SeaWorld taking a dive and UOR growing the Orlando customer base, I think it would work out fine.

I'm honestly not sure what's going to happen with Sea world and how they are going to stay in business. They are losing money quickly and even if they get bought out by someone like Six flags, Tampa is the more attractive park because of the coasters.

 

[mahnamahna]

The thing with DisneySeas is its actually like 75% original 25% IP which allows all the great theming and experiences. I do agree if a new 3rd gate is going to happen it needs a strong anchor but I want the rest of it to be 1000% original and new but still crazy level immersive and mind-blowing. Its not the IP that makes an attraction good, its the level of love and dedication of the creators that makes an attraction great.

The only problem is that American tourists aren't the same as Japanese tourists... Americans want to see their favorite characters, so sadly, original areas/attractions aren't going to be that plentiful.

Although DisneySea is more 50/50.

Little Mermaid
Indiana Jones
Toy Story
Finding Nemo
Aladdin
Sinbad
Journey to the Center of the Earth
20,000 Leagues Under the Sea

Despite the fact that those are all fairly unique to DisneySea aside from Toy Story Midway Mania and Turtle Talk, they're still based on IPs. 15 attractions based on IPs... I'm guessing around 15 that aren't. It may have been 75 original/25 IP when it first opened, but they've added a few IPs over the years.

 

[TylerDurden]

That could work - lots of potential

Sci-Fi - Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, Godzilla, Alien, Futurama, Doctor Who
Western - Hill Valley 1885?... this would probably be all-original IPs maybe a Fievel show?
Fantasy (more kid centric) - Laika, Smurfs, MLP, some non-IP based attractions
High Fantasy - LOTR and Warcraft
Horror - Classic Monsters, Psycho, Walking Dead
Anime (probably too niche) - Pokemon, Naruto, Dragon Ball Z, etc
Toons - Hanna Barbera, Sony Pictures Animation (not likely since they've got Laika, Illumination, and past connections to Nick and Hanna Barbera... no reason to add another), Nick

It might be too similar to USF and IOA if it's based just on genres. I could see it working, but it might be seen as an extension of the other parks unless they come up with a unique hook...

That sounds like a well-rounded place lol. It wouldnt be similar to the Studios at all in that it will ditch the backlot theme in order to be "DisneySea-quality". IOA, maybe, but there are ways to make it different enough without being redundant, like maybe having one overarching theme that ties into whatever rides they plan to put there.

 

[quinnmac000]

That could work - lots of potential

Sci-Fi - Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, Godzilla, Alien, Futurama, Doctor Who
Western - Hill Valley 1885?... this would probably be all-original IPs maybe a Fievel show?
Fantasy (more kid centric) - Laika, Smurfs, MLP, some non-IP based attractions
High Fantasy - LOTR and Warcraft
Horror - Classic Monsters, Psycho, Walking Dead
Anime (probably too niche) - Pokemon, Naruto, Dragon Ball Z, etc
Toons - Hanna Barbera, Sony Pictures Animation (not likely since they've got Laika, Illumination, and past connections to Nick and Hanna Barbera... no reason to add another), Nick

It might be too similar to USF and IOA if it's based just on genres. I could see it working, but it might be seen as an extension of the other parks unless they come up with a unique hook...

As much as people say Niche is bad; niche is good because you providing something other parks don't have for a set group of people. An example is Disney Princesses mainly for females 7 and under; however you can only get Disney Princesses at Disney so people go to Disney. Its better business to serve and cater to a group no one else caters to while catering to the masses.

And My main suggestion would to be add an completely original section which original attractions in the way LC was original.

 

[TylerDurden]

I'm honestly not sure what's going to happen with Sea world and how they are going to stay in business. They are losing money quickly and even if they get bought out by someone like Six flags, Tampa is the more attractive park because of the coasters.

Their revenue stream was higher than ever last quarter. Guest spending is actually increasing in the park despite a dip in attendance. SeaWorld actually looks to be in pretty good shape.

- - - Updated - - -

As much as people say Niche is bad; niche is good because you providing something other parks don't have for a set group of people. An example is Disney Princesses mainly for females 7 and under; however you can only get Disney Princesses at Disney so people go to Disney. Its better business to serve and cater to a group no one else caters to while catering to the masses.

The difference is Disney princesses are a HUGE niche...maybe only for young girls, but its appealing to EVERY young girl. Anime is attractive just to, lets say 20-somethings, but only a few of them, not the entire population of that group of people.

 

[Nick]

Yeah, this should be a pretty big concern...theyll also need to see how all their new hotel space does after the Potter hype wears out, because as is it seems to me they have a lot of hotel rooms for two relatively small parks.

The thing is that as is, IOA and Universal are not full-day parks. Its possible to do all the major rides in each park in less than a day. A third gate would probably serve more as a way to spread out capacity. If a third gate remains true to the nature of IOA and USF, it shouldnt require an extra day of vacation to enjoy. But I do agree it shouldnt be green-lit until USF and IOA are full with guests, which they arent even close right now.

The thing is with USF and IOA, you can fill up both parks to their max capacity and probably come close to hitting all the main attractions in a day if you tried just because of how close the parks are to each other.

This is where the "blessing of size" helps WDW. DAK and DHS have a lot less to do, but because of the distance between parks, guests feel like they need to stick it out at the park for the entire day.

- - - Updated - - -

Their revenue stream was higher than ever last quarter. Guest spending is actually increasing in the park despite a dip in attendance. SeaWorld actually looks to be in pretty good shape.

Hmm, I guess I just judged based on their decline in attendance (-5% at Sea World if you believe TEA) and the general lack of people in the parks. It would seem that loss of money would go hand and hand with that.

 

[mahnamahna]

Yeah, this should be a pretty big concern...theyll also need to see how all their new hotel space does after the Potter hype wears out, because as is it seems to me they have a lot of hotel rooms for two relatively small parks.

The thing is that as is, IOA and Universal are not full-day parks. Its possible to do all the major rides in each park in less than a day. A third gate would probably serve more as a way to spread out capacity. If a third gate remains true to the nature of IOA and USF, it shouldnt require an extra day of vacation to enjoy. But I do agree it shouldnt be green-lit until USF and IOA are full with guests, which they arent even close right now.

Yeah, the 3rd gate is probably 10-15 years down the road so Comcast should focus on rounding out the current parks (USF is pretty much full day once you fix KidZone and replace Fear Factor, IOA needs more than that) and get the waterpark in prime condition before focusing on a 3rd gate. Universal should make their goal to have 3 full day theme parks and 1 full day water park. WDW currently has two full day parks, 1 3/4 day park (AK), and 1 half day park (DHS)

I wouldn't want to see Universal rush/harm the good thing they have going on right now.

 

[DragonSlayer]

I'm kind of surprised that this is properly on the table alongside the waterpark as well... Good news though. I wonder what the total investment for building this scale and quality of park from scratch is nowadays? Considering IOA supposedly cost around $800m in the 1990s and the DCA rebuild cost $1.5bn, it would surely run to an astronomical figure. Wikipedia reckons DisneySEA cost $4bn but I would imagine that's a pretty big overstatement.